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What is everyone's opinion on repro parts?

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  • What is everyone's opinion on repro parts?

    Here's why I ask. I belong to a few GIJoe groups on facebook, as well as a vintage Star Wars group, and it seems to me that Joe collectors don't mind repro parts, as long as you can tell them apart from original parts and are NOT sold as original parts. But, as far as Star Wars collectors, all you have to do is say the word repro, and its as if you said a very bad word. It's either original or nothing. My opinion, I do not mind repro parts, especially if its for a part or parts that are rare and expensive and, like I said, you can tell it is not a original part and it is not sold as a original part. I have Cots body parts on some of my 12" Joes and I also have repro weapons for my vintage Star Wars figures. What os everyone's opinion since I have seen both ends of the spectrum for this topic.
    The Joe Collecting "Geek".
    Visit my online art store for some cool art prints:: www.etsy.com/shop/geekdragonart
    Also visit my Twitch page:
    www.twitch.tv/miketheretrogamer
  • #2

    Interesting topic, that can go in many different ways. Keeping in mind that opinions differ I will jump in.

    Depending on what you mean by repro parts . . . body parts for example are great for repair but I would not call them a restoration. For me the term restoration refers to the utilization of vintage parts to fix a vintage item. Cotswold gripping hands are a good example. For the purpose of my point lets say I have a minty KFG MOA whose hands are destroyed. Since vintage KFG hands are most often shot and need replacing I search for hands. Cotswold sells the hands already on the pegs. . .takes a matter of seconds and "Boom" the figure is "repaired". Take the same figure, and using vintage hands, same amount of time and "Boom" you have a "restored" figure. They will look almost identical, with the only difference being the look of the hands. Seasoned collectors can spot them 100 miles away. Same thing for ME and TC heads on vintage figures or mixed body parts.

    Restoring vintage figures is my passion and I have been doing it for years. I have never used a reproduction part in any of my work. In the event I ever try to sell any figure I have worked on, I will always give a detailed run down of what each figure went through and what parts were replaced. That way the buyer will never say they were not aware of the work I did on a figure.

    With that there is always going to be parts that I will buy for repairs of my stuff. Cotswold sells an excellent Jeep steering wheel and column that I have several of. Club did the repro Magnum Power set which is the only way any of us would have been able to afford a boxed set of the rarest of Joe outfits. Cotswold also sells some of the finest reproduction vehicle decals I have ever used. Much better than some other sets sold commercially. Though I have never claimed any of my vehicle repairs as restorations I can assure you I have repaired more than my fair share of vehicles. Some of which were featured in the Club Newsletter. Wit the introduction of 3-D printing there are more options for repro parts out there such as the coupler for the Sea Wolf.

    As for Star Wars collectors, they are like Transformer collectors, very outspoken. But I would not give them much thought. We been at this gig too long to get dragged into a petty squabble over a repro Strorm Trooper blaster. Wait until they see figures dyed in tea and passed off as rare AA versions.

    On the same note, I have found myself drawn to repair videos for Hot Wheels on You Tube. I can see where folks would be upset when they see Beach Bombs being mass produced in the rare pink variation from vehicles found in the junk pile. Some of their work is truly inspiring. I actually used one of the videos to breathe new life into an old Corgi Batmobile. The missiles, Batman and Robin and a few of the smaller parts are repros from Australia. A nice looking car but a ton of work.
    - Scott
    PH and Proud
    Bulletmann - Hyatta
    See photos of my collection on my Pinterest Page https://www.pinterest.com/scottbeckmann/gi-joe/

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    • #3

      Star Wars figures came with only one or two items, unlike a GI Jo that has tons of accessories and complex bodies. If you are going to collet a figure with only 6 body parts and a gun, I think it is fair to demand that all of those parts be original.

      Original Star Wars figures are also pretty crude, so their "play value" to collectibility ratio is different than a GI Joe - which is still a fun, well designed toy. So I'm not surprised that GI Joe people are more flexible in their view of the hobby. The Star Wars guys probably are secretly peeved we ever took the figures out of the package.

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      • #4

        Yeah I can get on board with that ideology.
        - Scott
        PH and Proud
        Bulletmann - Hyatta
        See photos of my collection on my Pinterest Page https://www.pinterest.com/scottbeckmann/gi-joe/

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        • #5

          Interesting. Defender, I have never really thought about repro parts in that way. I consider the replacement parts Cots sell as repro parts, but that's just me. Like I said, I'm just curious what everyone thinks. I'm not saying anyone is wrong, I'm just seeing different views, and it is all a matter of personal opinion. As long as you have fun with the hobby, do what pleases you the most. I am also a Star Wars collector, so I see both sides of the coin on this topic.
          Last edited by GeekDragon; 11-10-2018, 02:46 AM.
          The Joe Collecting "Geek".
          Visit my online art store for some cool art prints:: www.etsy.com/shop/geekdragonart
          Also visit my Twitch page:
          www.twitch.tv/miketheretrogamer

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          • #6

            Originally posted by GeekDragon View Post
            Interesting. Defender, I have never really thought about repro parts in that way. I consider the replacement parts Cots sell as repro parts, but that's just me. Like I said, I'm just curious what everyone thinks. I'm not saying anyone is wrong, I'm just seeing different views, and it is all a matter of personal opinion. As long as you have fun with the hobby, do what pleases you the most. I am also a Star Wars collector, so I see both sides of the coin on this topic.
            I could see calling Geyperman KFG hands "reproductions", while Cots parts are "compatible replacements". Cots parts aren't the same shape or color, but they usefully close.

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            • #7

              To me as long as not sold as Real
              if that what you want as Defender said.
              if want 1oo% restoration
              I ok with them I have at list 2or three Vintage Fuzz Heasd on Cots Bodies if it get them repaired .
              and back to play condition .
              I donot care .
              if I ever plan to resell I tell the Buyer
              and not sell as 100%.
              THAT IF I EVER SELL ANY!!

              Comment

              • #8

                The whole reproduction/ repair/ restore question varies from hobby to hobby.

                I would agree with Scott's views on restoring a vintage 'Joe, but in the doll world, taking vintage parts from one doll to fix another is considered a "marriage" and if that is known to have taken place my understanding is that it devalues the doll. I would bet that some 'Joe collectors would subscribe to that rule.

                The GeyperMan example is an interesting one because they use the original molds to produce those parts, so I would say they are a reissue, very close to NOS. Of course some of the accessories and uniforms are NOS/vintage.

                A restoration of an antique vehicle or historic house allows the use of new parts as long as those parts are historically accurate. NOS is preferred but not required.

                Of course it's all up to interpretation. For instance, I once watched a how to video on a nut replacement for a vintage Gibson guitar. One of the comments was from a guy who ranted that the video producer "ruined the value" of the vintage guitar by replacing the worn nut. To me replacing items like strings, nuts, and frets is SOP for a musical instrument in that they are designed to be replaced as they wear out through normal usage. Like tires on a car. Maybe that guy who ranted about the guitar repair was also a Star Wars collector?

                As far as I'm concerned, anything that gets a 'Joe back up to fighting form is AOK. I have some Marines with GIJCC camo helmets and the fact that they have "40th" stamped into them doesn't bother me a bit.
                Last edited by Joe90; 11-11-2018, 11:13 PM.

                Comment

                • #9

                  Originally posted by Joe90 View Post
                  Of course it's all up to interpretation. For instance, I once watched a how to video on a nut replacement for a vintage Gibson guitar. One of the comments was from a guy who ranted that the video producer "ruined the value" of the vintage guitar by replacing the worn nut. To me replacing items like strings, nuts, and frets is SOP for a musical instrument in that they are designed to be replaced as they wear out through normal usage. Like tires on a car. Maybe that guy who ranted about the guitar repair was also a Star Wars collector?
                  In cases like this, simply saving the original part avoids any problem in valuation. It's a nut, not a veneer. And a Joe collector could try saving old KFG hands or elastic, but that isn't going to help anything if they are already deteriorated.

                  Part of collector valuation comes from possessing things that have largely deteriorated with time, but you have an example that hasn't. In the case of MB joints, there are likely zero left intact, so it just isn't possible to talk about original mint condition, unless people like collecting figures with the arms dangling and full or rubbery dust.



                  But it certainly is a big deal to remove patina from 200 year old furniture vs a 200 year old painting. There are totally different rules depending on what the object is and how it is used. Joes, like old cars, are more functional items that are understood to be still used rather than sealed behind glass, so a certain amount of upkeep replacement is okay. Victorian dolls aren't like that.

                  Some time in the future the number of 100% original Joes will be pretty small, in part because current collectors don't treat them like art objects. That's when the values will be crazy high.

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                  • #10

                    This also could include O rings on 3 3/4" Joes. Is replacing a dried out O ring(which I have done on many of mine)a big deal? I have seen MIMP graded 3 3/4" Joes where the O ring snapped, which is because of age. Or even restringing vintage 12" Joes(which I have also done)because of the elastic drying out. I guess it all comes down to personal opinion, which is fine.
                    The Joe Collecting "Geek".
                    Visit my online art store for some cool art prints:: www.etsy.com/shop/geekdragonart
                    Also visit my Twitch page:
                    www.twitch.tv/miketheretrogamer

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                    • #11

                      I think people who collect for the purpose of investment, hate repros. I also think much of the Star Wars people are investors. I like repros. There are a lot of Joe items that are out of reach for the Common Joe Head like the FSA or the Mag power sets. What would stop Hasbro from making some molds and doing the whole line over again? It is not like they are printing money. I know there are people who want everything MIB and our absolute purist. That is their style of collecting. I also think repros help reduce collector hording. So if you have a few identical rare items and you know something is going to pop, you are probably are going to circulate them. Lastly, for internal items, like elastic or orings, I considered more of a maintenance issue. I do find each collector group to have certain traits and standards. My wife sold a Lego Star Wars figure on Ebay (picture clearly shown) and the buyer got mad she mislabeled the figure type.

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                      • #12

                        I totally agree with GI defender. When it comes to reproduction accessories, I like the repros better! A lot of the original GI Joe items like the barrel on the M1 garand we're really fragile. The reproductions, however, are a lot more rugged! Kids can actually play with them! And not have damage! Even as a kid I hated the Hasbro accessories made out of model plastic. My gijoe used Johnny West weapons more often than not. Johnny West Winchester took part in the heroic victory on D-Day, battled space aliens, and even went hunting for the rare family kitten. most of my childhood memories involve gijoe with Johnny West weapons because Hasbro stuff was so doggone fragile! Except for his trusty 45 pistol. He still wears that.

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                        • #13

                          I think part of the Star Wars collector’s aversion to reproduction accessories is the frequency with which repros are passed off as the genuine article. Contrast that with a company like Cotswold, which has always taken pains to make sure their items could never be confused with vintage.

                          As for me personally, when it comes to toys I had growing up as a kid, I’d rather hold out for vintage originals. Vintage 12” GI Joes predated me by some time, so I just get what I like, what I think looks good, and what I can afford. For example, I prefer the look of vintage heads to all later reproductions, but when it comes to uniforms and accessories, I’m not nearly so picky.

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                          • #14

                            Originally posted by KCE83 View Post
                            For example, I prefer the look of vintage heads to all later reproductions, but when it comes to uniforms and accessories, I’m not nearly so picky.
                            I'm right there with you. I love the original '70s heads and am happy to combine them with both vintage and modern accessories.

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                            • #15

                              I love my repro Joes, Action Men, Geyper muscle bodies, and now Estrela Falcon. Timeless, Wal-Mart, and others lead me to some vintage items., too. I'm proud of my repro 40th collection that includes customs and kitbashes. Repros have given me a lot of pleasure as a collector--it was a blast to use the Vintage 3d Joes site and assemble complete repro figures. Plus, I did some great customs like a Sea-Bee.

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